Posts by The Finger

88

Debunking the Watchtower - Slam Dunks and Solid Arguments

by Nickolas in

there's a wide cross section of thinkers on this board, representing christian belief and non-belief and points in between, the agnostics.

there is most definitely a minority, mostly silent, of devoted jehovah's witnesses present, too, but their contribution to the dialogue and dynamic of the board is minimal.

that small minority aside, it can be said the people who venture into here to communicate with one another share a common paradigm, and that is the watchtower is built on a foundation of clay.

The Finger

I think losing one's faith is dangerous. Just before my younger brother died he blamed his situation on his up bringing. My older brother is ill. He also feels some of his trouble started post 1975.

If I lost my faith in Christ I think I would suffer alot.

When I left the "truth" in alot of ways I wanted my wife to stay. One reason was I felt she could be leaving because of me. I wanted her to leave because she didn't accept it not because I didn't also it makes it more difficult for me to gauge my reasoning.

12

Hey Brits! Have you got snow?

by highdose in

jw
friends

i hear things are getting bad in the old country?

food shortages and money/ fuel running out.... i could start ranting here about the scandinavien countries who manage just fine with snow... but i'll let someone else do that.. i just heard that some people in north yorkshire got snowed in a pub for 8 days!...

poor things;).

The Finger

I have lived in a place that had a very cold long winter. They coped much better than here. Thankfully the worst seems to have gone from here at the present. But it was nice to not have to rise from my bed too early for a few days.

88

Debunking the Watchtower - Slam Dunks and Solid Arguments

by Nickolas in

there's a wide cross section of thinkers on this board, representing christian belief and non-belief and points in between, the agnostics.

there is most definitely a minority, mostly silent, of devoted jehovah's witnesses present, too, but their contribution to the dialogue and dynamic of the board is minimal.

that small minority aside, it can be said the people who venture into here to communicate with one another share a common paradigm, and that is the watchtower is built on a foundation of clay.

The Finger

When I was a JW I would not have come to sites like this or read books like Ray Franz. In the early nineties I had some big problems with the congregation Elders in the congregation I was attending. (One Elder who asked for a meeting with me told me some could have gone to prison) A friend asked me if I would leave the truth. I laughed. Later even when I had trouble with the new teaching in 1994. I still laughed when my father in law suggested I might leave. I think in the end I left because they pushed me away. I could not preach any more things I did not believe. In not preaching you are no longer a publisher and are not joining Christ's brothers or supporting them.

For me arguements didn't mean much. Truth belongs to God. Whatever I may have thought or not was of no importance. This was God's organization. I would adjust my viewpoint. So why didn't I?

In the last year I have spoken to some. They know things are not great, one has endured alot. Would they turn away due to my arguement? No. If they fail it will be due to themselves. I don't think there is anything I could possibly say that would make a JW leave. Only those that teach will do it.

3

God and the Biker

by only me in

a man riding his harley was riding along a california beach when suddenly the sky clouded above his head and, in a booming voice, the lord said, "because you have tried to be faithful to me in all ways, i will grant you one wish.

" the biker pulled over and said, "build a bridge to hawaii so i can ride over anytime i want.

" the lord said, "your request is materialistic, think of the enormous challenges for that kind of undertaking; the supports required reaching the bottom of the pacific and the concrete and steel it would take!

The Finger

That's great

20

Do you worry about money?

by Newborn in

jw
friends

when i was jw i never had money but that was how it was supposed to be (have a boring part time job and pioneer)...i didn't worry about my pension coz paradise would come long before i'd reach that age.

well, now i will grow old (hopefully) and i do worry a little bit about my pension.

however, i do have some money saved now and earn a good living.

The Finger

If I feel like it.

443

Generation Teaching - Everyone is speechless?

by Red Piller in

jw
friends

maybe the effect of this change is bigger than realized?

in 1995, it was discussed (positively) by everybody, during the week we studied the wt.

one elder stepped down and was looked down upon.

The Finger

Djeggnog

"I am a serious Bible student and I would judge your spirituality as weak based on your telling me here that you were one of those "Bible students" that actually believed the end was coming in 1975, a teaching that smacks of apostasy"

" More name dropping. Am I supposed to be impressed by personalities? Were governing body members or the more charismatic brothers among us, such as circuit overseers, district overseers, what helped you rise every morning, gave you that sun and rain, made your life worth living?"

No I wasn't trying to impress you as you claim to be a well educated man I'm sure you were aware of this.

Believing what you are taught by those who are appointed because they are qualified to do so and then have someone like yourself who claims to be qualified to such a position in the congregation talk of believing apostasy and try to paint those who listened and said "here am I send me" as bad and weak, truly sickens me.

443

Generation Teaching - Everyone is speechless?

by Red Piller in

jw
friends

maybe the effect of this change is bigger than realized?

in 1995, it was discussed (positively) by everybody, during the week we studied the wt.

one elder stepped down and was looked down upon.

The Finger

Djeggnog,

maybe you were too busy making a comfortable life for yourself rather than spending long days trying to save lives.

443

Generation Teaching - Everyone is speechless?

by Red Piller in

jw
friends

maybe the effect of this change is bigger than realized?

in 1995, it was discussed (positively) by everybody, during the week we studied the wt.

one elder stepped down and was looked down upon.

The Finger

"I am a serious Bible student and I would judge your spirituality as weak based on your telling me here that you were one of those "Bible students" that actually believed the end was coming in 1975, I am a serious Bible student and I would judge your spirituality as weak based on your telling me here that you were one of those "Bible students" that actually believed the end was coming in 1975, a teaching that smacks of apostasy since you should have known that such a teaching totally contradicts Jesus' words at Matthew 24:36 and Mark 13:32 that 'nobody knows that day or hour.since you should have known that such a teaching totally contradicts Jesus' words at Matthew 24:36 and Mark 13:32 that 'nobody knows that day or hour."

djEggnog,

I think it was Freddy who brought the subject up of the ending of the 6000 years are you suggesting he was an apostate? Do you think there is a big enough difference between suggesting and believing. Do you know what was in Fred Franz mind? Do you think he may have believed this himself? Would you, did you write to him and tell him how wrong it was? Or are you now just blaming those who listened to Christ's brothers and joined them in preaching these things.

443

Generation Teaching - Everyone is speechless?

by Red Piller in

jw
friends

maybe the effect of this change is bigger than realized?

in 1995, it was discussed (positively) by everybody, during the week we studied the wt.

one elder stepped down and was looked down upon.

The Finger

"I become defensive "

Eggnog the only reason you become defensive is because you went against the counsel of those who were taking the lead if you went on in further education.

45

Nobody forced us to believe. We CHOSE to follow their crap advice.

by hamsterbait in

have you noticed that the recent trolls are now claiming that if anybody drew conclusions or made decisions based on what the society was printing, it was their own fault?.

kind of "we didn't force you to believe what we said or adjust your life because of it.

you chose to think we were teaching the end would come in <insert time range>".

The Finger

"Nobody forced us to believe."

Hmmm, when I was about 20 I thought "I made the truth my own." I considered leaving it. I was on a train journey into London and I ran though all the reasons I believed it to be the truth. I came to the conclusion it was the "truth" This was some years after 75.

In the next 15 years of being a Witness there were many things I could not agree with but I always thought it was God's organization. I tried to live my life as a JW as best I could. I believed the generation of 1914 would not pass away before the end came. I had a long discussion with my father one evening (he had served several times as an elder) that if it failed they could not be right. We concluded that it wouldn't fail.

I had the blood issue come up a couple of times. I turned down taking out personal pension although I could have afforded it because I felt how could I believed the end was so close if I thought I might need one. A young brother tried to encourage me to go to a fine art school in the USA and my cousin tried to persuade me to go here in England. I dropped out of High School to pioneer as I thought the end was extremely close as much as I didn't particularly want too. I never every entertained ideas of being a servant or elder it was anathema to me. Later I saw it as something that was given only to be revoked as a measure of control.

Yes I made the decisions. Was I forced? I was mislead. I wouldnt mind if there was more honesty, I lived through the 60's and 70's I know what was said. I also know how we were to view the ones taking the lead and listening to counsel. I know how people were viewed who went on to further education. I believe God will judge us all. I like the last part of Romans 14:23 "... Indeed everything that is not out of faith is sin"